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In Defense Of A Pastor’s Views

May 24, 2013

To The Reader’s Forum: A recent letter not only labels Jeff Short’s religion as “hate,” but misunderstands and attacks Christianity itself....

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(101)

FedUpL8ly

May-24-13 4:15 AM

Excellent letter. It's a common tactic used quite often by those espousing liberal viewpoints to castigate any sincere disagreement as "hate" in much the same way they accuse anyone who opposes Barack Obama's policies as "racist". These aspersions should be rejected in a more vocal manner than in the past. Repudiation of these tactics will be more widely accepted by many as opposed to letting them go unanswered.

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50s4ever

May-24-13 6:31 AM

Damaged. Born or learned, makes no difference. Stuff happens.

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KingWahWah

May-24-13 6:39 AM

Liberalism has nothing to do with it. Leave political names out of this. Why not mock people who are wrong in their belief system? Gays don't choose to be the way they are, no more than a hetero can. We don't need justification from people who believe in the invisible msn who doesn't exist. There are a lot of higher issues that need to be blessed and here we are fighting about gays. Again. Hats off to the fella who "mocked" Jeff Short.

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KingWahWah

May-24-13 6:41 AM

And for those who keep calling those with difference of opinions things like LIBERAL or CONSERVATIVE, maybe you should go and live with your lopsided friends in some other land. You'll get along just fine.

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southernman

May-24-13 7:12 AM

Great letter, very well said. Disagreement does not equal hate. Hate is used as an inflammatory argument. Christians are accepting of all people that are repentant of their sinful ways, and Christians are loving to all people, regardless of backgrounds. There is a difference there between love, hate, and acceptance. Paul instructs the people to "expel the immoral brother", not to hate him. The gate to eternity is narrow, some will figure it out, but many will not.

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BudZilla

May-24-13 7:43 AM

"Pastors were once respected by unbelievers..."

NOPE. Pastors were once respected by Christians. Those outside your religion don't care about your leaders' funny outfits.

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whyaduck

May-24-13 7:51 AM

The hateful attacks that have replaced reasoned debate in our society saddens me too. The "Church" set itself up for this when it became a major political force a couple decades ago. Politics is a tough game and no one should expect the response to any hard stand to be nice and genteel. When prominent leaders of the church blame the gay population for the moral decline of our world it calls their judgement into question..what about human trafficking, universal healthcare, greed. WWJD? Then there is the hypocrisy, when an outspoken Christian leader like Ted Haggard is outed for having a long-term relationship with a gay prostitute we wonder about other outspoken leaders. Perhaps thou dost protest too much? Then there are the outrageous statements by Falwell, Robertson, etc.. The Church has to clean up it's own back yard before launching a national assault on gays who are looking for equal rights like survivor's benefits, next-of-kin rights.

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nonfiction

May-24-13 8:19 AM

"We see no widespread protest and attacks from adulterers"

If there was a law that didn't allow adulters or divorcees to marry/remarry there would be outrage. If gay marriage is viewed as a civil rights issue and not social-moral-religious issue it takes away the grey area. You can disagree with someones lifestyle, or protest against it, protest the protest (westboro baptist church) but do not restrict the rights (that the majority have) of someone because of who they are if it be gay, black, white, based on your religious, social, or political views.

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Howard

May-24-13 9:02 AM

Here we go again; comparing gays to adulterers, addicts, thieves, prostitutes and occultists. Also, by the way, you do NOT know two ex-gays. You know to people that "tried something" as many do and didn't care for it or you know two bisexuals that repress their gay side. If you truly know two "ex" gay people then they are living a miserable life, just as a heterosexual would if they suppressed all of their sexual desires. The country is changing as the younger generations are not agreeing with the hate that this letter writer and Jeff Short continue to spew. I am glad that I have lived long enough to see this turn-around.

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southernman

May-24-13 10:30 AM

Although I agree with the letter writer, I will also say that the comment by nonfiction was also well written. Good counterpoint; makes for good debate rather than pointless rhetoric.

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apologeticsnow

May-24-13 12:52 PM

non-fiction, what are those rights based in or sourced from? If they merely come from man, then they merely exist willy-nilly subject to change by whatever the trend is for that day. If they come from God, then they are there for keeps. If marriage is just man's idea, then the homosexuals have the right according to the opinion of man to homosexual matrimony. If marriage is instituted by God, then who are we to tell Him that His definition is wrong and man's is right?

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Overdrive

May-24-13 1:21 PM

Regarding the statement that 100 local pastors agree, I think 100 disagree, too!

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lucky

May-24-13 1:58 PM

apologeticsnow, I was married by a Justice of the Peace. Does that mean I have a fake marriage? I have heard many ministers say "By the powers vested in me by the STATE OF NEW YORK I now pronounce you man and wife. must be marriage is something from man since there is a separation of church and state. My license is from the state, no where does it say my marriage is approved by anybodies God. I have been married for over 34 years.

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SCALLYWAG

May-24-13 5:44 PM

Great letter once again the fairys are trying to justify there disgusting behavior. God will have the final say

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LindaD

May-24-13 7:25 PM

Another day, another gay-bashing letter from one of the usual suspects ... complete with the rest of the local KKK klaven chimin' in...

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SCALLYWAG

May-24-13 7:32 PM

I'll have to read the Manuel but I'm not sure the KKK has taken up the gay agenda yet. They pretty much have there plate full with the others. One group can only do so much.

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KingWahWah

May-24-13 10:24 PM

"DR", learn the historical connotation of the OLD TESTAMENT before reading me the riot act on the New. Being gay isn't a choice, being Christian is. Learn to love people for who they are not what. Pretty simple. Quit making excuses.

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troglodyte

May-25-13 8:42 AM

We don't need man or god to tell us sodomy is perverse, filthy, loathsome, and depraved and we don't need a yen for it ourselves to know it is immoral. Leftists are naturally rude, vicious, and mob oriented. Alinsky systematized and organized these tendencies into an invincible pure evil that is destroying civilization. It was each year, now each month less liberty, more ugliness.

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duckster

May-25-13 9:20 AM

Get off Rev Mel's case. Yes he struggles with latency issues but he was born that way.it is not a choice.

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Emelye

May-25-13 9:28 AM

No, people call it hate when rhetoric like Seadog's, calling gay people "fairies" and when troglodyte's unhinged rants about "perverse, filthy, loathsome, and depraved" sexual practices are publicly expressed.

When Christians use Leviticus, along with the other parts of a Bible that they consider 100% accurate and without error, to condemn gay men they are calling for gay people to be executed. That's not hateful?

To be so self righteous as to believe that, "Some think that love means ignoring sin. But that would be as un-loving as doctors ignoring cancer," is to be hateful. A same sex orientation is not a deadly disease, nor is there any inherent harm in it.

Yes, Dr. Braley, you are free to proclaim your beliefs but we are also free to proclaim our disagreement.

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Emelye

May-25-13 9:35 AM

"America was founded on religious freedom, and our laws and institutions were based on Judeo-Christian philosophy and law."

No sir, you are incorrect. The founders used Greek and Roman law as well as English common law which all in many ways agreed with Christian philosophy but we have a civil, secular government, not a theocracy. Your version of Christianity has no business being promoted over others in our laws.

As a private organization, the Boy Scouts have the right to change their policies as they see fit yet now they are receiving intense, nasty pressure from the christianist right wing. It seems hypocritical of you to condemn one but not the other kind of pressure.

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Emelye

May-25-13 9:41 AM

Dr. Braley wrote, "Sadly, I know of no group in 2,000 years of Christian history that has responded to the Gospel with the bitterness that the homosexual movement and their supporters do today."

I beg to differ. I strongly suspect the Gnostics responded to the established version of the Gospel in quite equal bitterness but their writing and their very existence was practically erased by the oppression they suffered from the Church. They too were suffering under a church that had become part of the political fabric and was forcing its dogma onto people if they liked it or not.

LGBT people are tired of the oppression and marginalization they suffer under. Too many people still justify their prejudice and hatred with religious rhetoric. It isn't the Gospel they are bitter about, it's the egregious use that it has been put to by those who oppose them.

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troglodyte

May-25-13 9:48 AM

There is a difference between revulsion and hate. Normal people are naturally revolted by filthy, loathsome, depraved behavior. I hate homosexual activists only because and only since they force this down my throat, rub my nose in it, and express hate for me.

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KingWahWah

May-25-13 10:56 AM

Trog, I find what people call normal sex filthy..but do you see me calling people out on it?

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Emelye

May-25-13 11:32 AM

Revulsion is just one side of hate, sir, and your extreme rhetoric embodies it to the nth degree. Keep it up, however, please! Your off the wall screeds do a lot to prove what LGBT people have to deal with in the world. I know a lot more people feel the same way you do but are unwilling to express it so plainly.

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